New Essay - 10 Ways that Charmed is better than Buffy

[DianaBouvier99]

Spoliers for Season Seven





I refrained from commenting about this essay because I felt you made some very good points. Charmed established their the rules of their universe early and have stuck to them. While Buffy seems to glory in breaking their rules anytime the "shock value" warrants it. My problem with Charmed was that it in no way represented any form of Wicca that I know or have heard of in over 19 years of study. To me Charmed was nothing more than a glorified mouth piece for the Christian Right--good vs. evil--the Four Horsemen, the Source (IE the Devil), getting married in the church instead of using a hand fasting, etc. (This is not to say there isn't a WIccan tradition that follows Charmed, afterall Wicca is really hundreds of different pagan traditions thrown together under one name.)



But then I read the spoilers that have the slayer being created out of a demon. To me that was really just another reason why I could never watch Buffy again. For five years it was implied that God chose the slayers and that was one of the reasons that it was so tragic that Faith went bad. Now we find out that a Slayer isn't a hero or Chosen by God but is part demon and by association evil.



This is another example why Charmed is better than Buffy--because the Charmed Ones are good, are Heroes, and Buffy never was--will never be a real Hero.



I know I don't believe in the Christian God or his counter point/other aspect Satan, still I cannot tell you how much learning this about the Slayers has disappointed me.



Once again, thank you BB for your essays.





Spoilers for Season Seven Above

[Jimmi Magnus]

Bob, perhaps someone read your essay:

Quote:

---

Drew Goddard says:

(Fri Feb 28 07:53:34 2003)



Oh boy, we got a late night tonight. Apparently we are here 24 hours a day working to bring you the best programming this side of Charmed.

---

The rest of the guys drivelfest can be found here:

www.cise.ufl.edu/%7Ehsiao...30228.html

-I feel as if a kitten sat on my face all night

[WebWarlock]

Oh. I know they did.



I even know who (what computer) and how long they were there.



'Nother feather for you Bob. You anoy them enough that they are still thinking about you weeks later.



Warlock

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Web Warlock

The Other Side,
home of Liber Mysterium: The Netbook of Witches and Warlocks

"It was so dumb." - Amber Benson on the death of Tara.

Edited by: WebWarlock at: 3/5/03 4:40:01 am

[BBOvenGuy]

Quote:

---

I even know who (what computer) and how long they were there.

---

Oooo! Details, please?

"If you are going to give a new message to the world, you will do so without being conscious of it yourself. If you set out to do it consciously, you will fail because you will be trying to pose; and the man who poses is insincere." - Charles V. Stanford

[WebWarlock]

It was an IP address that belongs to the computer that Jane E usually uses when she posts to some other unnamed board.



The page was viewed for about 15 minutes then they exited the site.



This was back around Valentines day.



I can't be sure, but I believe that came in to the page from the previously mentioned website.



I wrote the IP addy down, but don't have it here.



I also got visits from Fox's legal and the FCC around the same time. I am *really* worried.



Warlock

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Web Warlock

The Other Side,
home of Liber Mysterium: The Netbook of Witches and Warlocks

"It was so dumb." - Amber Benson on the death of Tara.

[BBOvenGuy]

Good old Jane. Maybe I should have included some ratings numbers. They're another way that Charmed is doing better than Buffy, after all, and her view of them is obviously obstructed from where she's sitting.

"Good luck with your childrens' writing -- since I've got a three year old, I know that that kind of writing is probably the most important kind."

- Brad Kern, Executive Producer of Charmed, to me!!!

[sam7777]

Bob: Here are Charmed updated ratings.



Charmed national ratings by episode: (from futoncritic/sfgate)

2002-2003 season: 09/22/02 - 3.1/5 (2 eps) 09/29/02 - 3.1/5 10/06/02 - 3.1/5 10/13/02 - 3.1/5 10/20/02 - 3.2/5 11/03/02 - 2.9/4 11/10/02 - 3.2/5 11/17/02 - 3.1/5 01/05/03 - 3.2/5 01/12/03 - 3.2/5 01/19/03 - 3.0 02/02/03 - 3.3 02/09/03 - 3.1 02/16/03 - 3.3	2001-2002 season: 10/04/01 - 3.9 (2 eps) 10/11/01 - ?.? 10/18/01 - 3.7 10/25/01 - 3.3 11/01/01 - 3.1 11/08/01 - 3.1 11/15/01 - 3.2 12/18/01 - 1.9 01/17/02 - 2.4 01/24/02 - 2.7 01/31/02 - 2.4 02/07/02 - 2.9 02/14/02 - ?.? 03/14/02 - 3.1 03/21/02 - 3.4 03/28/02 - 2.7 04/18/02 - 2.4 04/25/02 - 2.7 05/02/02 - 3.1 05/09/02 - 3.2 05/16/02 - 3.4

Charmed is in it's 5th season. That' something that Firefly never did and that Angel may never do.

_____________________

I see dead lesbian cliches

Edited by: sam7777  at: 3/6/03 3:02:42 pm

[Hair Annoyed]

My God! That's almost freakishly consistent.

[sam7777]

Yep ME can only dream of steady ratings like this on any of their shows or such a loyal fan base. Charmed creators care about their fans and it shows in the ratings.

_____________________

I see dead lesbian cliches

[Sheridan]

Quote:

---

Though I don't pretend to think that Charmed is anything more than just entertainment;

---

I think that statement encapsulates the single most important reason why 'Charmed' has overtaken Buffy, and good work Bob!

Willow: ...I have to tell you....

Tara: No, I understand you have to be with the person you l-love

Willow: I am

[sam7777]

I added in my post above the ratings for last season of Charmed that I could find. When "Charmed" was on the fence last season, it's ratings ranged from a low of 2.4 to 3.9 for the premiere. This seasons steady 2.9-3.2 national ratings shows that "Charmed" has a steady and stable fan base. I notice that there is not talk of it being on the fence at the WB this season unlike Angel. I couldn't find the ratings for 2 dates: 10/11/01 and 2/14/02.

_____________________

I see dead lesbian cliches

Edited by: sam7777  at: 3/6/03 10:45:36 pm

[BBOvenGuy]

You also have to consider that Charmed was on Thursday nights last year. Not only have the fans stuck with the show, but they moved with it to a night where the WB was previously getting killed. I'd think the WB suits would be very happy about that.

"Sure it's simple, writing for kids. Just as simple as bringing them up." - Ursula K. LeGuin

[sam7777]

They are happy enough to use it as a successful lead-in for "High School Reunion" which has been renewed for another run and it will soon be a lead-in for "Black Sash". Charmed has been leading a "charmed" life in the ratings this season. I'm glad as it has never been a show to forget their fans.

_____________________

I see dead lesbian cliches

Edited by: sam7777  at: 3/6/03 10:48:31 pm

[justastraightdog]

Buffy's sixth season and Charmed's fourth ended in Germany recently. It was one of the most successful Buffy seasons ever over here. "Grave" got stellar ratings (for a US series episode on German tv), especially in the 18-49 demographics. Charmed had 2.5 million viewers that night at 8.15 pm and Buffy's finale had 2.1 million viewers at 9.15 pm, not a bad retention for a lead-out. Grave was still way behind the ordinary Charmed episode that aired as a lead-in, but most of the time the 8.15 pm slot has more viewers than the 9.15 pm slot, anyway.



But this week the Charmed season 4 finale was aired. At 8.15 pm it had 2.6 million viewers, and the finale episode at 9.15 pm had - a whopping number of 2.9 million viewers. Both shows had almost the same ratings mid-season, now Charmed has left Buffy way behind. And given the (visual ) quality of the season opener and the rock solid ratings in the USA, they really can look forward to air season five of Charmed.

_______________________________
Though here at journey's end I lie in darkness buried deep, beyond all towers strong and high, beyond all mountains steep,
above all shadows rides the Sun and Stars for ever dwell: I will not say the Day is done, nor bid the Stars farewell.

[BBOvenGuy]

This just in from thecharmedones.com:

Quote:

---

The producers of 'Charmed' will be making an extra episode for this season. There might be a possibility that Brad Kern has something special in store for this extra (last) episode of season 5. It was heard that it might be a possible 2 parter episode (2 hour show).

---

Hmmm... let's see here. Entertain the viewers and give them what they want = more work and more money. Think you know what the viewers "need" and give them depressing nonsense = getting your shows cancelled. Is that really so hard to figure out?

"Sure it's simple, writing for kids. Just as simple as bringing them up." - Ursula K. LeGuin

[emma peel]

Gee, Bob. Perhaps Brad Kern listens to his fans, has read your essay, and knows how much people are hating and leaving Buffy.

He sounds like a smart guy, compared to some other a**holes (Jay-Dubya and Mutant Enema) we've come to know and dislike so much this last year.

Janice

[BBOvenGuy]

Janice, Brad Kern has read my essay. Go back a page and check out the email he sent me.

"Sure it's simple, writing for kids. Just as simple as bringing them up." - Ursula K. LeGuin

Edited by: BBOvenGuy  at: 3/10/03 1:03:24 pm

[emma peel]

Whoops, sorry Bob. I did read that. Must be that ear infection I have making me kinda out of it and forgetful.

By the way, Bob, since Brad knows you and you're great buds now, you could become a writer for Charmed! . (but only if you'd want to. Wouldn't that be an untimate irony for ME, a Kitten writing for Charmed. God forbid the possibility of someone like Jane E. getting a job there. ).

Janice

[sam7777]

Bob, great news about "Charmed"!. The fact that they are doing an extra ep is a stron indication that the WB plans to renew it and why not. The show is putting out quality and entertainment and has a steady and loyal fan base and near eerily steady ratings. It's been a successful lead-in. I read an article in SciFi magazine where Bob Kerns says that they had some problems last season and worked hard to do better this season. It shows. On the other hand, ME refused to see their problems and just keep on sinking.

_____________________

I see dead lesbian cliches

[DianaBouvier99]

Just wanted to say because of this essay (and the fact that I had a major multi-level spinal fusion so I'm stuck in bed) I've started watching the Charmed re-runs on TNT.



Okay the topic of the post: I just finished watching the Phoebe goes evil story arc and I am impressed. That was very well done. But you know what really tugged at my heart strings and made it hit home that Buffy was truely gone? At the end of the show Phoebe was laying on her bed crying her eyes out with grief and the sisters go and get into bed with her and hold her. They don't say a single word--they just support her. That was a very emotionally powerful scene.



Just like the one between Willow and Buffy in The Prom; its something that we never see anymore. The characters on Buffy actually careing about each other.



Where as Buffy talks about how they are Family and yet they never show it on screen.



Thanks for telling me about Charmed.

Edited by: DianaBouvier99 at: 3/11/03 6:34:39 pm

[sprhrgrl]

I actually just started watching Charmed, finally caving into my Rose McGowan hunger now that I can't see A Certain Lovely on TV. Even though I've only seen like three episodes, I very much understood (although my heart wants me to use the word 'felt') most everything mentioned in your essay. Well done.

sprhrgrl.com

counting*stars

racism=sexism=homophobia

The truth shall set you free, but first it will piss you off. – Gloria Steinem

[WebWarlock]

Well here is an interesting turn.



On the Buffy RPG developers list we have been talking more and more on how one could use the Buffy rules to make "Charmed: The Roleplaying Game".



You were ahead of the curve Bob and now everyone is looking into Charmed as a Buffy alternative. Even people that make a living writing about Buffy.



Hopefully your check from Spelling is in the mail.



Warlock

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Web Warlock

The Other Side,
home of Liber Mysterium: The Netbook of Witches and Warlocks

"Tell me, what is my life without your love

Tell me, who am I without you, by my side
" - George Harrison "What Is Life"

[ra da el]

hi... almost a lurker here... mainly because I've got a terroble english.

I'd like to say... may I disagree with the concept that Charmed is a good show, or better then Buffy season 1 throughout season 6-half of ep seeing red?

I watched some eps of charmed here in Italy, and I think it has poor character in-depth, bad written dialogues, no-intriguing actors and stereotypical plots (I know, the clichè proposed by JW is the worst thing, but again, that doesn't make of charmed a good alternative).

Just a thought, I stopped watching Buffy, but Charmed....



Kisses



/ 4 ever

[sam7777]

Quote:

---

On the Buffy RPG developers list we have been talking more and more on how one could use the Buffy rules to make "Charmed: The Roleplaying Game".

---

It makes sense for them to develop a game for a show that will acutally be on the air next season and has audience growth. I hope that Chamred gets it's due not that Bufy is gone.

_____________________

I see dead lesbian cliches

[darkmagicwillow]

While getting rid of Cole was a good idea, as he'd clearly overstayed his time on the show like a certain vampire with a soul on Buffy, the current season seems to be drifting without him. The baby episodes were surprisingly good, but they're doing too many overly silly theme episodes like Witches in Tights and the leprechaun one they advertised for next week. Charmed feels like it's drifting, but even so, it's better than the s7 episodes of Buffy where the FE yet again does nothing. I'll stick with no story arc over a story arc where nothing happens.

--

"Omnia mutantur, nihil interit." -- "Everything changes, but nothing is truly lost."

[Guinevere]

Is Charmed going to be back next season?

Edited by: xita  at: 4/16/03 11:37:09 pm

[BBOvenGuy]

Yup, they've already been renewed.

"The first task of anyone, lest you get canceled, is to entertain people, because they ain't there for message." - Dick Wolf

[Garner]

I found the first couple of seasons of Charmed to be fairly poorly written and the characters fairly lame too. However, starting the season before Pru lef there were glimmers of decent plots, the addition of Cole really helped, and than Paige really helped turn things around.



I feel that Cole was not used well this season and that there were other things they could have done with him to split him from Phoebe but still keep the character around. Mostly with the Avatar direction which I liked quite a bit. Unfortunately they seem to have decided that Cole couldn't live without Phoebe and so it is probably better they got rid of him than kept him around too long like that vampire. Still, I do agree that this season has drifted more than necessary without Cole. And so far I have also been impressed that the baby hasn't dominated or ruined the show.



Garner

[BBOvenGuy]

Cole was written out at the request of Julian McMahon, who felt like he had taken the character as far as he could. That's another difference between Buffy and Charmed - Brad Kern actually listens to his cast members instead of thinking of them as little more than "meat puppets."

"The first task of anyone, lest you get canceled, is to entertain people, because they ain't there for message." - Dick Wolf

[sam7777]

I was watching a boit of Charmed on the scifi channel this morning and it struck me how the characters there have real lives. They were doing a scene at Pipers club and I could see 3 responsible women trying to balance life and heroism. That's a whole lot better than the arrested adolescents that Joss Whedon has given us on Buffy these past two seasons. Willow, Buffy and Xander were more heroic when they dealt with real life as well as monsters. Their lives are not realistic for 20 somethings or any other human beings.

_____________________

I see dead lesbian cliches