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Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

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Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby drusilla(d) » Mon May 27, 2002 7:43 pm

I really dont care what happens next season. But i do know for sure is, that if next season they all just up and forgive Willow for nearly ending the world and attempting to kill her friends, and then actually killing a human (if you really want to consider warren a human.) But still, relistically, i wouldnt think they would forgive her right off. Epecially Buffy. And if she isnt doing alot of groveling next season and they just forget it. Then i will be even more pissed off then i am right now. And i dont even want to think about if they have her with someone else, that will be the end if i see that happeneing, i will be writing more letters to the company and to joss even more then i do now. thats just not right. Thank you for letting me rant.
drusilla(d)
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby The Partisan » Mon May 27, 2002 7:48 pm

Not that I really care, but something's been on my mind. I haven't watched any new episodes post SR, so I'm just going off of the wildfeeds, but is it clear that Willow actually kills Rack? Some people say she drained him, others say he was killed. Or is it just inconclusive?
The Partisan
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby AutumnT » Mon May 27, 2002 7:49 pm

According to the script he is dead dead dead.
AutumnT
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby drusilla(d) » Mon May 27, 2002 7:51 pm

What exaclty is Rack? Is he human but just a warlock or something....i dont know so i figured id ask you guys. Cuz if he is human, then she killed two humans. Which isnt any better, but just thought id bring that up.
drusilla(d)
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby slayer747 » Mon May 27, 2002 7:54 pm

I don't care if Rack is dead...

HECK, KILL THEM ALL!

(the subject says "rant", right?)
slayer747
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby tommo » Tue May 28, 2002 3:50 am

I'm not sure if Rack's all human. But hey! I don't care! :)
tommo
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby Kaisyn » Tue May 28, 2002 4:43 am

Got the song. Thanks Puff!
Kaisyn
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby BBOvenGuy » Tue May 28, 2002 12:23 pm

Does anyone know what the final ratings for the final two hours were? I saw the overnights - they got smackdowned by the WB's lineup again, by more than a full point in both hours - but I haven't seen the final numbers. Did they break 3.0?
BBOvenGuy
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby Kendahl897 » Tue May 28, 2002 3:30 pm

I haven't looked, but I know the Nielsen ratings people have thier own website where you can find the ratings for your favorite shows. I also noticed that today's USA Today has a full page listing all the shows on TV and their rankings. Didn't have enough change to buy it, but it's there. Hope that's some help.........
Kendahl897
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby helpful information perha » Tue May 28, 2002 4:22 pm

actually the Nielsen folks don't give their ratings away for free you have to buy them. Some media and sites do publish limited info on the numbers.
In todays USA Today they listed the season average top shows in the major demographic groups. Buffy wasn't one of them - not even in teens. Interesting Greg the bunny was listed in the top for teens (5th I believe) but it was axed. I'm surprised a weblet hasn't picked it up given its demographic draw.

USA Today publishes the previous weeks prime time national ratings on wed (sometimes held up to thur).

You can also check the futoncritic.com site for ratings information. scifiwire and cinescape often list the top 10 genre ratings (although buffy has been missing the list often this year).

Variety, the hollywood reporter and Broadcast and Cable also do ratings reports on occassion
helpful information perha
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby relativegirl » Tue May 28, 2002 4:34 pm

The final national ratings for 5/20-5/26 will be in tomorrow's (Wednesday 5/29) Daily Variety & Hollywood Reporter (I think Nielsen releases them during the middle of the day on Tuesdays so anything published early Tuesday a.m. won't include the final numbers). Villians posted a final rating of 3.2, so I am assuming that the two 5/21 episodes will be in the low 3s as well.

Edited to add: We get the trades at work every morning, so I'll post the final numbers in this thread as soon as I get them.

Edited again: No ratings in today's (5/29) Daily Variety -- maybe tomorrow.
relativegirl
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby Kendahl897 » Tue May 28, 2002 4:40 pm

Good, may be cruel of me to say, but I hope ME learns that when you treat your fan base so badly by lying to them, they will tune out and find something else to watch
Kendahl897
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby hilarita » Tue May 28, 2002 4:47 pm

i dont think its cruel. or if it is, its justified. i would love for them to think back to the end of this season and think, man, did we ever fuck that up. but thats just me.
hilarita
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby JJtheCool » Tue May 28, 2002 6:14 pm

According to EW, Buffy had 4.5 million viewers for new eps this season, up 2% from last season, and UPN was the #5 network over The WB, which all of us probably would have cheered had this season not ended so badly.
JJtheCool
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby Sela » Tue May 28, 2002 6:34 pm

Okay, so what's the deal? Yes, ratings good, or no ratings bad? Actually, I'm not entirely sure I care. I'm just gonna pretend like Buffy ended right at "I hope so, that's the best part." (Tara smile).

--Sela
Sela
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby relativegirl » Tue May 28, 2002 7:43 pm

I looked, but could not find, the story on EW that said BtVS ratings were actually up compared to last year. The only story I found is more tepid in its praise: www.ew.com/ew/report/0,6115,249705-6-7~10~0~,00.html

Based on what the Nielsen ratings show -- so far this season it looks like ratings are down 5.86% (these figures don't include TTG or Grave b/c the final ratings for those shows aren't in yet, only the overnights are in): www.thefutoncritic.com/cgi/gofuton.cgi?action=ratings&type=seasontodate&id=20012002 BtVS is ranked no. 123 on that chart.

If you want to see how ratings have fallen over the start of this season: www.thefutoncritic.com/cgi/gofuton.cgi?action=tracker&id=buffy_the_vampire_slayer

We'll know for sure in the next few days how BtVS did this year compared to last.
relativegirl
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby xita » Tue May 28, 2002 8:11 pm

Yeah i have no idea what statistics jj is quoting.
xita
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby helpful information perha » Wed May 29, 2002 4:41 am

Buffy is down in the National Ratings by 6% this year and I suspect the average will be down by more than that once the 52 week season ends since repeat airings of this years new episodes are performing so poorly.

National Numbers for Buffy's finale will not be out until thursday due to the monday holiday


here is Mediaweek's reporting of the metered market numbers for May 28ths repeat airing of Barganing part 1

[Over at a smiling WB, repeats of Gilmore Girls (#5, 3.7/ 6) and Smallville (#5, 3.8/ 6) held up particularly well with an average 106 percent advantage over UPN's non-original combination of Buffy, the Vampire Slayer (#6, 2.0/ 3), Girlfriends (#6, 1.6/ 2) and The Parkers (#6, 1.7/ 3)]

Seems folks are getting aquainted with the girls gilmore, or watch them again (they have a 6 share in repeats and were pulling about a 7 share on average for new eps this year), while Buffy's 3 share (usually a 5 sometimes 6 share for new eps this yr) suggests about half its audience is saying no thanks to the repeats
helpful information perha
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby relativegirl » Wed May 29, 2002 4:53 am

Thanks HIP. Duh, I forgot about Monday being a holiday.

With BtVS' season ratings down 6%, I'm particularly happy that Bargaining did so well when it aired on 10/2 (4.3 rating, 7 share) b/c it demonstrates that people were able to locate Buffy on their TV schedules even though it had changed networks which means TPTB can't blame this season's ratings drop on changing networks.
relativegirl
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby helpful information perha » Wed May 29, 2002 5:09 am

UPN was airing old movies on tuesdays at 8 last year. These movies drew VERY poor ratings. Pretty much anything over a 2 at 8pm tuesdays is an improvement for UPN. Buffy has therefore been a major gain for them in the stats. None the less, Buffy's numbers have slide from last years tue/8pm showings AND buffy has been in a consistent slide since it opened on UPN this year.

More people tuned in for Buffy's opening on UPN this year than did fans tuning in for the season 5 opening on WB
so the audience was there and sampled the show. However they didn't stay to watch and Buffys numbers quickly dropped and have kept on dropping

This is in spite of the fact that UPN's overall numbers have been on the rise and that UPN on average is outperforming WB this year!

___________
excerpted from
Media week
2001-02 Broadcast Season Averages: NBC Wins; CBS Second; UPN on the Rise
Fri May 24,12:13 PM ET

In the land called weblet, kudos go to a growing UPN, which thanks to Enterprise and Buffy, the Vampire Slayer (even a declining Buffy is still a relatively potent player) outdelivered the WB in all below categories with year-to-year gains of 12 to 19 percent. UPN's rating among adults 18-34 was its best ever for any full season with total viewers and adults 18-49 it's highest in five years

results in each category (with percent change vs. 2000-01 in parentheses):
-Households UPN: 2.7/ 4 (+12), WB: 2.5/ 4 (no change)

-Total Viewers:
UPN: 4.29 (+11), WB: 3.78 (+ 1)
-Adults 18-49:
UPN: 1.8/ 5 (+12), WB: 1.6/ 4 (no change)

-Adults 18-34:
UPN: 1.9/ 6 (+19), WB: 1.8/ 5 (- 5)
-Adults 25-54:
UPN: 1.8/ 4 (+12), WB: 1.5/ 4 (no change)

Source: Nielsen Media Research (9/24/01-5/22/02 vs. 10/02/00-5/23/01). Averages for the week of 5/13/02 are based on preliminary ratings.
helpful information perha
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby Puff » Wed May 29, 2002 5:14 am

Xita, JJ is quoting from EW's roundup of the season. It was in this week's magazine.
Puff
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby helpful information perha » Wed May 29, 2002 7:44 am

metered market ratings for the season compared to last year and then broken out by first airing of new eps and then again by reruns (I'll post the National Numbers when I get a few min to put them together)

Make of them what you like
but would seem to me the gap between last year and this year is widening

r = repeat episode

Barg 1-2 opener avg bests last yr on WB by +0.4
but buffy slides from there

S6.........S5.......difference
6.2/9.5.8/9....+0.4 Barg 1-2
4.9/7.....5.0/7.......-0.1 Afterlife
4.4/6.....5.0/7.......-0.6 Flooded
4.5/7.....5.4/8.......-0.9 Life Serial
4.5/6.....3.1r/5.....+1.4 All the Way Vs repeat last yr
4.5/6.....5.1/7.......-0.6 Once More w/Feeling
4.3/6.....5.1/7.......-0.8 TR
4.2/6.....4.7/7.......-0.5 Smashed
4.3/6.....4.8/7.......-0.5 Wrecked
2.8/4r....3.5/5r......-0.7
2.8/4r....3.6/5r......-0.8
2.7/4r....4.8/7.......-2.1 repeat Vs first run last yr
1.6/3r.....2.6/4r.....-1.0
2.5/4r.....3.8/5r.....-1.3
4.4/6......4.6/7......-0.2 Gone 1/8/02
2.5/4r.....3.7/5r.....-1.2
2.4/4r.....5.0/8......-2.6
4.2/6.......3.5/5r....+1.7 DM Vs repeat last yr
4.0/6.......5.3/8.....-1.3 DTs
3.9/6.......5.0/7.....-1.1 O&FA
2.4/3r......5.0/8.....-2.6 repeat Vs first run last yr
3.9/6.......5.5/8.....-1.6 AYW (2/26/02)
4.3/7.......3.5/5r....+0.8 Hells bells
3.9/6.......3.3/5r....+0.6 Normal
2.8/4r......3.2/5r.....-0.4 TRr
2.7/4r......2.8/4r.....-0.1
2.5/4r......3.3/5r.....-0.8
2.3/4r......2.7/4r.....-0.4
2.4/4r......4.7/7......-2.3
2.3/4r......4.8/8......-2.5
3.6/5.......4.6/7......-1.0 Entropy 4/30
3.8/6.......4.8/8......-1.0 SR 5/7
4.0/6.......4.7/8......-0.7 Villans 5/14
4.1/6.......5.5/8......-1.4 TTG 5/21
and at 9pm 4.3/6 2nd hr Grave
2.0/3r.......4.5/7r.....repeat Barg. 1 5/28


Only First airings of new eps
S6.........S5.......difference
6.2/9..Barg 1-2
4.9/7.....Afterlife
4.4/6.....Flooded
4.5/7.....Life Serial
4.5/6.....All the Way
4.5/6.....Once More w/Feeling
4.3/6.....TR
4.2/6.....Smashed
4.3/6.....Wrecked
4.4/6.....Gone 1/8/02
4.2/6.....DM
4.0/6.....DTs
3.9/6.....O&FA
3.9/6.....AYW (2/26/02)
4.3/7.....Hells bells
3.9/6.....Normal
3.6/5......Entropy 4/30
3.8/6......SR 5/7
4.0/6.......Villans 5/14
4.1/6.......TTG 5/21
and at 9pm 4.3/6 2nd hr Grave



New episodes as compared to same week of last year
Barg 1-2 openers avg bests last yr on WB +0.4
But buffys numbers slide from there on out

S6.........S5.......difference
6.2/9.5.8/9....+0.4 Barg 1-2
4.9/7.....5.0/7....-0.1 Afterlife
4.4/6.....5.0/7....-0.6 Flooded
4.5/7.....5.4/8....-0.9 Life Serial
4.5/6.....3.1r/5...+1.4 All the Way
4.5/6.....5.1/7....-0.6 Once More w/Feeling
4.3/6.....5.1/7....-0.8 TR
4.2/6.....4.7/7....-0.5 Smashed
4.3/6.....4.8/7....-0.5 Wrecked
4.4/6......4.6/7...-0.2 Gone 1/8/02
4.2/6.......3.5/5r.+1.7 DM
4.0/6.......5.3/8..-1.3 DTs
3.9/6.......5.0/7..-1.1 O&FA
3.9/6.......5.5/8..-1.6 AYW (2/26/02)
4.3/7.......3.5/5r.+0.8 Hells bells
3.9/6.......3.3/5r.+0.6 Normal
3.6/5.......4.6/7..-1.0 Entropy 4/30
3.8/6.......4.8/8..-1.0 SR 5/7
4.0/6.......4.7/8....-0.7 Villans 5/14
4.1/6.......5.5/8....-1.4 TTG 5/21
and at 9pm 4.3/6 2nd hr Grave

The wedding gave the sliding ratings a bit of a pick up but then the ratings cont. to be under 4 until the last 2 weeks of the season

Repeat airings as compared to ratings from same week of last year

S6.........S5.......difference
2.8/4r....3.5/5r......-0.7
2.8/4r....3.6/5r......-0.8
2.7/4r....4.8/7.......-2.1 repeat Vs first run last yr
1.6/3r.....2.6/4r.....-1.0
2.5/4r.....3.8/5r.....-1.3
2.5/4r.....3.7/5r.....-1.2
2.4/4r.....5.0/8......-2.6 repeat Vs first run last yr
2.4/3r......5.0/8.....-2.6 repeat Vs first run last yr
2.8/4r......3.2/5r.....-0.4 TRr
2.7/4r......2.8/4r.....-0.1
2.5/4r......3.3/5r.....-0.8
2.3/4r......2.7/4r.....-0.4
2.4/4r......4.7/7......-2.3 repeat Vs first run last yr
2.3/4r......4.8/8......-2.5
2.0/3r.......4.5/7r....-2.5 repeat Barg. 1 5/28
helpful information perha
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby DawnsMan » Wed May 29, 2002 10:25 am

Hell Hath No Fury Like Lesbians Looking Up Ratings

:spin
DawnsMan
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby Kieli » Wed May 29, 2002 11:03 am

And your point is?? :mad
Kieli
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby helpful information perha » Wed May 29, 2002 11:05 am

hmmm, well as much as it may surprise you, some of us st8 folk are Amber fans and just as offended by what has been presented on Buffy this season as the lesbian community.

The continual degradation of females and minorities, especially on shows that target youthful audiences effects the cultural conscience of society now and for decades to come. Perpetuating bigotry benifits no one, be they male, female, st8/sexual minority etc.

The media are out to sell their products, no matter how.
Most of the supposed "news" piecies via entertainment rags (printed and online) are simply put "spin"/Adverts to sell the product. Reviewers are courted for positive reviews with everything from "insider info" to dinners to access to stars to well you get the point. Media rags are more advertisement than journalism

Ex. EW didn't publish the fact that Buffy's overall ratings are down year to year or that its female and teen demographics (which advertisers pay more for) or down or that its numbers are sliding from begining of the season. Instead to put a pos spin on Buffy's numbers they pulled out the first airing of each eps numbers and printed that the average total audience figures for that subset were up slightly - without normalizing for growth in population, number of stations airing etc. In otherwords they found a stat they could use in a positive light and spun it

The best way to delineate the truth is to have the data, all the data, so people can draw their own conclusions, rather than have someone play games with subsets of data to try and spin it to the positive. When did anyone ever hear of a shows stats being presented for just the first airings of the season episodes - I'll tell you when - when its the ONLY way to show a positive stat for the season!


___

FYI

I looked for the info JJ noted at EW.com but I could only find this piece (excerpted below) which says buffy and enterprise started strong but then slid and GG's beat buffy for its time slot. Interesting that UPN looks to buffy to give it ligitamacy which - given this years fan outcries and reviewers barbs says to me - UPN cannot be all that pleased with Whedons direction season 6 and explains why he is "going back to basics" season 7.

EW.com

The Upside-down Season
Our wrap-up of this TV season's winners and losers. Hot was cold (adios, ''Ally McBeal''), old was new (hey there, Carol Burnett), and small was big (coochie-coo, ''Baby Bob'') by Dan Snierson

UPN
RANK No. 5 in total viewers; No. 5 in 18-49
THE GOOD
Maybe the shamefaced days of ''Homeboys in Outer Space'' truly are in the past. Decent-size audiences boarded ''Enterprise'' (making it the netlet's highest-rated drama at No. 112) and staked out WB transplant ''Buffy the Vampire Slayer'' (No. 124). ''Both ['Buffy' and 'Enterprise'] made statements about UPN,'' says CBS' Kahl, who also oversees UPN scheduling (both nets are owned by Viacom). ''They brought some new viewers, they add some legitimacy.'' In other news, ''WWF'' -- oops, excuse us -- ''WWE Smackdown!'' had a headlock on the No. 105 spot. THE BAD
''Buffy'' and ''Enterprise'' slid a bit after exploding out of the gate, and the netlet's horrid luck in the reality genre (''Chains of Love,'' anyone?) continued with family series ''Under One Roof'' (No. 156). Plus, fellow midseason hopefuls ''The Random Years'' (No. 159) and ''As If'' (No. 156), both of which aired on Tuesday night, packed all the ratings punch of a hair-removal infomercial. Says Kahl: ''They were well outside of what the UPN audience expects -- comedies on what is not a comedy night, comedies that took a big chance, as it turns out, maybe a little too big.'' Or not.
THE UPSHOT
If ''Buffy'''s success can bleed into new otherworldly drama ''Haunted'' and ''Enterprise'' can power the remake of ''The Twilight Zone,'' UPN just might be able to keep a certain frog at bay next season.

THE WB
RANK No. 6 in total viewers; No. 6 in 18-49
THE GOOD
The Gilmore, the merrier: The underdog family drama ''Gilmore Girls'' (No. 122) outdrew time-slot rival ''Buffy the Vampire Slayer.'' Its lead-out ''Smallville'' soared to No. 112. And ''7th Heaven'' preached to more viewers than either of those shows (No. 97). But in an act truly sent from above, ''Reba'' anchored an otherwise bleak Friday at No. 130. ''It proves not only that we can create a hit sitcom,'' says WB Entertainment prez Jordan Levin, ''but a sitcom that appeals to the whole family.''
THE BAD
The Jamie JFK Experiment yielded some big laughs but not-so-big numbers at No. 145. ''Sunday night was a very difficult place to see that show,'' laments Levin, who will use it next season as counterprogramming to ''Will & Grace'' on Thursdays. He adds: ''Because there's buzz, I think it's on the verge of breaking out.'' No. 154 My Guide to Becoming a Rock Star generated an audience size inversely proportional to the length of its title. (''I'd rather fail with a show that is at least trying to be different,'' reasons Levin.) Meanwhile, Bob Saget couldn't draw a full house with ''Raising Dad'' (No. 141), ''Popstars 2'' pooped out (No. 147), and midseason reality series ''No Boundaries'' was fenced in at No. 156.
THE UPSHOT
Since former laughingstock UPN isn't exactly stocked with laughs, The WB needs to keep digging for another comedy success like ''Reba'' so it can stop singing the basement blues.
(Additional reporting by Caroline Kepnes)
(Posted:05/31/02)
helpful information perha
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby sparrow » Wed May 29, 2002 1:05 pm

Way too many number and still Tara is dead.
sparrow
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby DawnsMan » Wed May 29, 2002 1:12 pm

Hey, I didnt mean to make anyone angry at all. Hopefully I didnt. Im a HUUUUUGE Amber fan and I miss her to death. Ive just been feeling so down lately because of whats happened so I just wanted to try and make people smile. Guess that didnt happen.....Sorry guys!

~DawnsMan

"I dont know a breed of humans this small."
DawnsMan
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby AutumnT » Wed May 29, 2002 1:23 pm

Gotta say, I'm enjoying Television Without Pity's review of "Grave" because as usual they are pointing out every single STUPID thing about that episode. Plus I kinda think Cruella D'Will singing "See my vest. See my vest. I made it from Warren's chest" is funny.
AutumnT
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby Gatito Grande » Wed May 29, 2002 2:42 pm

[quote:e15776ba28][b:e15776ba28][i:e15776ba28]Quote:[/i:e15776ba28][/b:e15776ba28]
GG's beat buffy
[/quote:e15776ba28]

Would if I could, h.i.p.! ;)

About the TWOP, yeah, that line's funny, even if they did rip it off from The Simpsons. Monty Burns: "See my vest! See my vest! Made from real gorilla chest!"

GG [i:e15776ba28] witticisms fail me[/i:e15776ba28] Out
Gatito Grande
 


Discussion S6E21&22 Two to Go&Grave&qu

Postby roamin » Wed May 29, 2002 2:49 pm

Hey HelpfulInformationPlease - what you wrote would make a great letter to the network execs, ME, Zap2it, Slate and many others ...... just an idea.
roamin
 

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